Village Specialization > Rigid Nukes

[DeletedUser2754]

Yes, Inno released that information but it actually doesn't work that way. That's why I said it was a myth created by TW2 wiki or an explanation tutorial. It was not a personal attack, just a simple correction. I'm sorry if I offended you, that was not my intention.

If you equip a paladin in a nuke with 1000ax+200lc with the axe weapon, the axes will be affected by the weapon bonus.
If you equip a paladin in a nuke with 1000ax+250lc with the axe weapon, the axes will be affected by the weapon bonus.
If you equip a paladin in a nuke with 1000ax+500lc with the axe weapon, the axes will be affected by the weapon bonus.
If you equip a paladin in a nuke with 1000ax+1500lc with the axe weapon, the axes will be affected by the weapon bonus.

So it doesn't matter the provisions relation within the nuke for the weapon effect, even if Inno says they matter. I'm not sure if they plan to implement this in the future, but right now it doesn't work that way.

 

[DeletedUser1594]

i think you guys are arguing about two different things, yes the weapon will work on the targeted group, jehzir is saying that during the actual battle the paladin would fight with the largest group

 

[Citrus]

So it doesn't matter the provisions relation within the nuke for the weapon effect

This is correct, I have just tested it.

 

[DeletedUser1323]

i think you guys are arguing about two different things, yes the weapon will work on the targeted group, jehzir is saying that during the actual battle the paladin would fight with the largest group

Shekel you know of my skill level therefore, there is no need to argue with those who do not want to be enlightened. To call out something as misinformation that has no proof, only proves they want to believe their version of the truth so bad they have to continue to spew lies to back it up. I took my information right from the code itself. Not from hearsay, made up tests or anything else.

 

[DeletedUser2754]

Not that it matters but I actually said this...

That might be true for the fight power of the pally itself (although that is irrelevant in a big attack) but the weapon he carries always takes effect whatever the composition of the nuke.

 

[DeletedUser2635]

I'm sorry if I offended you, that was not my intention.

I like this very much, I can remember writing this exact sentence myself more than a couple of times.

Shekel you know of my skill level therefore, there is no need to argue

Which doesn't mean your knowledge is without flaws.
While it is true that the Paladin fights with the army with most Provs, I do not see how that affects anything at all, so I do not see which point you were trying to prove.

Aside from that, yes your specialized nukes are a nice thing to have (I have played 1 world with only LC and it has worked fine for me), but it heavily depends on the stage of the game - that is why @hibakusha is also right, at the stage of the game he is currently in, specialized nukes probably do not mean much to him, well it is safe to say that it is very playstyle dependent.

Also I don't think I have ever met a nicer person than him, so I can assure you he only wanted to share his opinion and it was never his intention to offend you in any way, I think it was your intention to get offended.

 

[DeletedUser2754]

Thanks Kei!

 

[DeletedUser2193]

Why do I get the feeling that most of what @jehzir said is not correct or you are just terrible at writing what you want to say?
I'll have to side with @hibakusha

Remember that nobles stack with the infantry

What do you mean? Do you mean their 30 Off pow stack with infantry? Or you mean they fight and DIE along with the infantry group. if so then why don't my nobles die when I send them with LC only? the noble alone should be fighting at least the wall and thus die. I've never used much axes can someone confirm/deny that?

The pally will stack with the greatest provision unit and then leave the rest of the nuke vulnerable
I never stated weapon

How exactly is moving 150 off power to different group making at least 600'000 off power nuke vulnerable? Ofc I (and I assume @hibakusha) assumed you were talking about the pally weapon.

This nuke will also attack in 4 rounds at 25% of the total for the entire nuke

Could you elaborate on that? Its first time I've heard of this.

have done a lot of coding with the actual game engine so I know what it is doing.

Has really someone gotten their hands on the battle engine that the tw2 uses? I have no clue about the computers, but if so why do we still have the discussions about rams if this is the case?

You may not agree with it but to make it a personal attack by stating it is incorrect when Inno themselves are the ones that RELEASED this information then you may want to reassess what you post

And if you are talking about the video about the battle system the info in the video has been proven wrong in the pally weapon thread and I'm sure there is 1 more thing wrong about the group fights.
Its not a personal attack when you state a fact that is actually correct. Maybe as @shekel finder said you are not talking about the same thing. but that doesn't make @hibakusha wrong.

If it was just a misunderstanding and you were not talking about the weapon id let it slide but then you say this.

To call out something as misinformation that has no proof, only proves they want to believe their version of the truth so bad they have to continue to spew lies to back it up. I took my information right from the code itself. Not from hearsay, made up tests or anything else.

Which makes me think you were actually talking about the weapon or you are just not reading what @hibakusha wrote.
Citrus can probably post you the reports if you still insist on the believing your version of the truth or just look at the pally weapon thread.

 

[DeletedUser1323]

I really think you all need to take reading comprehension classes. You are talking about different things. You are talking about the weapon he carries. I am talking about the GROUP he stacks with infantry/cavalry or archer group. This DOES matter as it will be a matter of group survival, if the pally dies in a battle group the weapon effect IS LOST. So example he is carrying the LC weap, but he dies in the infantry round. then that weap bonus IS LOST on the remaining rounds! The rounds of the mixed nuke setup goes like this... rams/infantry/cavalry/archer/ram(if any survive)is based on the rams getting the before and after fight strikes at half power. That strike takes 25% of the infantry stack to "protect" the rams, if they are present.

 

[DeletedUser2635]

This DOES matter as it will be a matter of group survival, if the pally dies in a battle group the weapon effect IS LOST.

Not true.

I know it is not true because we tested battles where the whole attacking force died, yet the Weapon effect was still applied. And it was done on the actual game engine on a test world.

 

[DeletedUser2754]

The pre-battle of trebs against rams can't kill the pally. The infantry, cavalry and archer groups all fight at the same time, so weapon always takes effect. I'm not sure if weaponized for cats or rams and died in battle but one of the other groups that is not the one that takes the most provisions survived, it the weapon would be valid for the last cat/ram assault.
From what I know and seen, I'd say it would still give its bonus to the offense, but I'm actually not sure. And if you say it does, and that you tested it, I take your word for it, but I would also like for you to post some reports that validate your point beyond doubt. I would be really grateful for you. I like to understand how the battle engine works and I try to collect all info I can gather.

 

[DeletedUser2635]

I like to understand how the battle engine works and I try to collect all info I can gather.

https://en.forum.tribalwars2.com/index.php?threads/paladin-in-attacks.2854/

 

[DeletedUser486]

I believe the only thing that is determined from which group the Paladin travels with is his chances of survival. It certainly has no effect on the weapon bonus whether he lives or dies.

As for nobles, in TW1, Nobles used to fight with the infantry and so if infantry dropped below 50% to casualties the noble died. Always. I know for certain this is different to an extent for TW2 in that there is always a chance of a noble attacking the village loyalty, even if it dies. I checked this myself when I moderated and was getting tickets asking why loyalty was dropping to dead nobles.
That said, I have a suspicion that the weighting doesn't work as it should. For instance, it is my experience that rams are more effective when accompanied by axes, though they are supposed to work just as well with cavalry, similarly, nobles are supposed to work as well with cavalry but it is my experience that they are less so. Though this is just my perception and is not substantiated.

 

[DeletedUser1323]

We are still talking different things. I am trying to peel back some of the layers and trying to answer this question as best as possible.
The rounds do happen all at once, they cover 1ms, but are calculated by round after the combat is complete, which is why we get some lag to the calculation of the report.

Yato's experiment thread would not expose the round effects as he uses the exact same counts and is doing a DIFFERENT EXPERIMENT.

Yato, then it seems we still have undocumented combat actions going on that are not listed in any of the game updates. I know that the pally death bug, is no longer resolved, it was "reported fixed" at the time you did your experiments. Now the loyalty SHOULD drop as the action for the scepter does take affect in the infantry round the first round no matter if he dies, that is confirmed in the code.

 

[DeletedUser2754]

jehzir, that's why I asked you to do this...

From what I know and seen, I'd say it would still give its bonus to the offense, but I'm actually not sure. And if you say it does, and that you tested it, I take your word for it, but I would also like for you to post some reports that validate your point beyond doubt. I would be really grateful for you. I like to understand how the battle engine works and I try to collect all info I can gather.

I have found out in the last days that rams are archers if alone but with escort they fight with the largest group. This actually changes a lot of the battle ongoings and some of my assumptions are now clearly wrong. For instance I thought zerks died less in the game than in my calculations, that was because I was considering rams to be infantry/general type and in my calcs zerks had to defeat the extra troops that came to cover for the rams extra provisions. I might have other assumptions wrong because of that.

Anyone knows how the initial wall bonus reduction is calculated?

 

[DeletedUser2635]

Yato's experiment thread would not expose the round effects as he uses the exact same counts and is doing a DIFFERENT EXPERIMENT.

Dude I don't care what is supposed to work, I was just stating (with actual facts) how it works.

Which means you were wrong, you overestimated your knowledge...

 

[DeletedUser2754]

Kei, he could be right on some special cases.
I mean if you send 1000 lc + 3999 axes + pally with the axe weapon against 10k spears. Pally will fight with the largest provision group, the cavalry.
On the first round all LC will die and the pally with it. Axes will be boosted with the pally weapon on the first round and kill their share of spears. But question is, and this is what I think jehzir is implying, for the second round, when the surviving axes have to face the surviving spears will they be boosted with the pally weapon as well or not...
I always assumed they would, what jehzir is saying is that they will not...

Yato, can you test the numbers I gave above on the test server and paste here the report with the results. I think I can get a conclusive answer if I have that report.

 

[DeletedUser2635]

According to the battle tutorial, infantry fights first mo matter how the Provisions are distributed, Provision distribution account only for how big a percentage of the def army each attacking group will face, at least according to the video.

Yato, can you test the numbers I gave above on the test server and paste here the report with the results. I think I can get a conclusive answer if I have that report.

No can do, he does not have access anymore, already asked him.

 

[DeletedUser3198]

Kei, he could be right on some special cases.
I mean if you send 1000 lc + 3999 axes + pally with the axe weapon against 10k spears. Pally will fight with the largest provision group, the cavalry.
On the first round all LC will die and the pally with it. Axes will be boosted with the pally weapon on the first round and kill their share of spears. But question is, and this is what I think jehzir is implying, for the second round, when the surviving axes have to face the surviving spears will they be boosted with the pally weapon as well or not...
I always assumed they would, what jehzir is saying is that they will not...

Yato, can you test the numbers I gave above on the test server and paste here the report with the results. I think I can get a conclusive answer if I have that report.

I wanna know this.

 

[DeletedUser3159]

It is all personal opinion on what you have. I never have axes, I think they are useless and the defence on them is awful. on the other hand some people love them and have thousands, It is more about testing what you prefer.